Remember when Ben Shapiro said in an interview that his sisters “can’t watch TV anymore because of all the raunchy broadcasting”? Well, we think Ben’s parents should prohibit Ben from watching TV, because it’s warping his mind (and a mind that was carefully homeschooled for all those years is a terrible thing to waste).
Yes, sadly Harvard Law student Ben turns out be be just another coach potato preoccupying himself with steamy fantasies involving Jack Bauer, as shown in his latest column “Where’s Jack Bauer When You Need Him?.” (The title apparently refers to Ben’s belief that we need Jack Bauer to torture Andrew Sullivan until Sully recants his claim that torture is wrong.)
Anyway, here’s a bit from Ben:
Anyway, I’ll let the rest of you weigh in on this — I want to go get Jack Bauer and have him “persuade” Ben to enlist in the infantry.
Posted by s.z. on Wednesday, January 17th, 2007 at 5:58 pm.
Yes, sadly Harvard Law student Ben turns out be be just another coach potato preoccupying himself with steamy fantasies involving Jack Bauer, as shown in his latest column “Where’s Jack Bauer When You Need Him?.” (The title apparently refers to Ben’s belief that we need Jack Bauer to torture Andrew Sullivan until Sully recants his claim that torture is wrong.)
Anyway, here’s a bit from Ben:
No one doubts that arbitrary torture is wrong. Were we to pull random American citizens from their homes and drag them into a cell for a bit of waterboarding, we would undoubtedly be destroying our own moral fiber and discrediting our history. We would be no better than the Islamists we fight. But there is a fundamental difference between our treatment of non-citizens and our treatment of citizens.Watch out, Canadians!
This does not mean we should treat all outsiders as terrorists. We should treat outsiders with civility as long as they do not threaten our civilization — this in and of itself distinguishes us from our enemies. If, however, outsiders threaten our civilization, we should do what we deem necessary. If we must sometimes get our hands dirty to protect Western civilization, so be it. Western civilization is not a fragile edifice, infinitely susceptible to fruits of fascism. We will not become Nazis because we torture terrorists. We can safely fight our enemies without destroying that which makes us what we are.That’s an Interesting belief for a religious man: that Western civilization is so strong that we can torture all the terrorists we want without ever turning into the bad guys. But here are some questions for Ben: Just how many “terrorist associates” can we torture before we become Nazi-esque? How many of those who were in the wrong place at the wrong time when we conducted a roundup can we torture before we lose the moral high ground? And what if we find that torture isn’t effective, but we do it anyway, just because it gives us the illusion of power over our enemies — doesn’t that cause some kind of a cloud over our claims to being civilized? And if, as you say, the one question we must ask ourselves when deciding how to treat our enemies is “Do the benefits of torture in this case outweigh the harms?” then why not use that standard for every case when we are dealing with somebody who might be a danger to our civilization? Why not torture child molesters, war protesters, and litter bugs?
Anyway, I’ll let the rest of you weigh in on this — I want to go get Jack Bauer and have him “persuade” Ben to enlist in the infantry.
Posted by s.z. on Wednesday, January 17th, 2007 at 5:58 pm.
33 responses to "Somebody Needs to Get Out More"
We should treat outsiders with civility as long as they do not threaten our civilization
A proud Jewish person is unabashedly, unironically offering this view. Yikes.
A proud Jewish person is unabashedly, unironically offering this view. Yikes.
Humorously enough, Kiefer Sutherland is a Canadian citizen, born in London. He’s not an American, unless you mean, you know, North America, and on the whole the Canadians are kinda down on our torture thing at the moment. They seem to take offense when we engage in extraordinary rendition on their citizens before admitting–oops!–hey, that guy wasn’t a terrorist after all! (I don’t believe we’re real popular in England just now, either.)
Mr Sutherland, it should be noted, is the grandson of Tommy Douglas, a Scottish-born social democrat and highly revered political statesman who, here’s the bit that’ll give Ben the vapors, created the Canadian healthcare system. You know, that socialist stuff. (Why do I know this? I watch Canadian TV. A lot, as it turns out.)
Mr Sutherland, who appears to be a reasonably nice person, is probably the antithesis of everything Ben likes about his character, thereby illustrating why it’s good to have lines between fiction and reality.
To further illustrate this premise, a few more examples:
A) Just because FOX News tells you they found WMD in Iraq, does not mean that is reality.
B) Despite what the guys at Powerline and Chris Matthews tells you, Dubya is not, and probably never has been, “manly”.
C) Contrary to Focus on the Family’s research, people were having oral sex long before Clinton was elected president.
D) Your government has foiled exactly zero (0) terrorist plots of the ticking-time-bomb, or even the ticking-IED, variety through the use of what people marginally less sociopathic than Dick Cheney would call torture. If you can counter that assertion, please do. Give specifics.
The funny thing is, assuming the proverbial ticking bomb concept ever came up in real life, and I, personally, could save a few thousand people by torturing someone, I would very likely do so. Certainly I have pounded the shit out of people before in the defense of far less. But I suspect that if I did that, no jury would convict me of that assault. Assuming, of course, that I had the right guy, and that he knew anything useful, and that I actually did manage to save people.
Although, really, if I’m willing to torture to save lives, I’m absolutely willing to go to prison to do it, too.
I’m guessing that for most of us, the ethical and moral issues would outweigh the legal issues in such a situation. For the people who feel compelled to argue that torture should be legalized in whatever form, I have to wonder if the ethical and moral issues even present themselves for consideration. I also wonder if these people are willing to, say, sacrifice everybody *but* themselves in the defense of their ideology. (Who said ‘chickenhawk’? It wasn’t me, I swear.) And I further wonder if these people are essentially saying that they would suffer no guilt had they gotten the wrong guy, or tortured his innocent son in front of him, or got the wrong information, torture being notoriously unreliable, just as long as they suffered no legal penalties.
And that’s a pretty fucked up way to run a system of morals, Ben. Janet Jackson’s tit and Britney Spears’ muff will never do to our nation and our humanity what the open acceptance of torture, and indeed war, as “just another tool in the box” has done. So you could either shut the fuck up about it, or you can stop lecturing us on morality. ‘Kay?
Mr Sutherland, it should be noted, is the grandson of Tommy Douglas, a Scottish-born social democrat and highly revered political statesman who, here’s the bit that’ll give Ben the vapors, created the Canadian healthcare system. You know, that socialist stuff. (Why do I know this? I watch Canadian TV. A lot, as it turns out.)
Mr Sutherland, who appears to be a reasonably nice person, is probably the antithesis of everything Ben likes about his character, thereby illustrating why it’s good to have lines between fiction and reality.
To further illustrate this premise, a few more examples:
A) Just because FOX News tells you they found WMD in Iraq, does not mean that is reality.
B) Despite what the guys at Powerline and Chris Matthews tells you, Dubya is not, and probably never has been, “manly”.
C) Contrary to Focus on the Family’s research, people were having oral sex long before Clinton was elected president.
D) Your government has foiled exactly zero (0) terrorist plots of the ticking-time-bomb, or even the ticking-IED, variety through the use of what people marginally less sociopathic than Dick Cheney would call torture. If you can counter that assertion, please do. Give specifics.
The funny thing is, assuming the proverbial ticking bomb concept ever came up in real life, and I, personally, could save a few thousand people by torturing someone, I would very likely do so. Certainly I have pounded the shit out of people before in the defense of far less. But I suspect that if I did that, no jury would convict me of that assault. Assuming, of course, that I had the right guy, and that he knew anything useful, and that I actually did manage to save people.
Although, really, if I’m willing to torture to save lives, I’m absolutely willing to go to prison to do it, too.
I’m guessing that for most of us, the ethical and moral issues would outweigh the legal issues in such a situation. For the people who feel compelled to argue that torture should be legalized in whatever form, I have to wonder if the ethical and moral issues even present themselves for consideration. I also wonder if these people are willing to, say, sacrifice everybody *but* themselves in the defense of their ideology. (Who said ‘chickenhawk’? It wasn’t me, I swear.) And I further wonder if these people are essentially saying that they would suffer no guilt had they gotten the wrong guy, or tortured his innocent son in front of him, or got the wrong information, torture being notoriously unreliable, just as long as they suffered no legal penalties.
And that’s a pretty fucked up way to run a system of morals, Ben. Janet Jackson’s tit and Britney Spears’ muff will never do to our nation and our humanity what the open acceptance of torture, and indeed war, as “just another tool in the box” has done. So you could either shut the fuck up about it, or you can stop lecturing us on morality. ‘Kay?
Hey, I’m being moderated. Are you guys cracking down on my long-and-ranty-ness? And if so, why on earth did you wait so long?
Western civilization is not a fragile edifice, infinitely susceptible to fruits of fascism.
Apart from that time in the 1930s when Western civilisation did succumb to the fruits of Fascism.
We will not become Nazis because we torture terrorists.
Unlike the Nazis, who did become the Nazis because they tortured terrorists.
Apart from that time in the 1930s when Western civilisation did succumb to the fruits of Fascism.
We will not become Nazis because we torture terrorists.
Unlike the Nazis, who did become the Nazis because they tortured terrorists.
D: I’m not sure why your comment was flagged, but the next one, from Doktor Bimler, was also thrown into the moderating hopper. It could be the WordPress software has simply adopted Dick Cheney’s 1% doctrine regarding blog commenters. Or it could be that, due to an avalanche of spam in the past few weeks, s.z. and I have had to gradually add more and more previously innocuous words to the spam filter, like “tonsure,” “knuckle-duster” and “sandwich.”
I actually figured it was my references to starlets’ anatomy. These things happen when VBen gets to be the morality police, after all. Which is not to say I’d blame you guys for deciding to Take Measures against my constant comment thread monopolization. I am easily amused.
If you take Ben’s column, and make a few replacements (“torture” with “terrorist attacks”, “Western civilization” with “Islam”, and “terrorists” with, say, “hedonistic blood-thirsty satan dogs”) you get an article that could appear on the editorial page of the Al-Qaeda Enquirer or something Mohammed Atta might have said in his suicide tape.
For examples:
“[Islam] is based on opposition to [terrorist attacks]. But [Islamic culture] has never been based on the idea that we must treat enemies of [Islam] with the same care we treat allies.”
“If we must sometimes get our hands dirty to protect [Islam], so be it… We will not become Nazis because we [commit terrorist attacks on] [hedonistic blood-thirsty satan dogs].”
“the answer is that [terrorist attacks] will often serve a useful purpose. The ['vastly overpowered'] scenario, wherein [a terrorist attack] is necessary to save lives from imminent destruction, is an obvious example.”
For examples:
“[Islam] is based on opposition to [terrorist attacks]. But [Islamic culture] has never been based on the idea that we must treat enemies of [Islam] with the same care we treat allies.”
“If we must sometimes get our hands dirty to protect [Islam], so be it… We will not become Nazis because we [commit terrorist attacks on] [hedonistic blood-thirsty satan dogs].”
“the answer is that [terrorist attacks] will often serve a useful purpose. The ['vastly overpowered'] scenario, wherein [a terrorist attack] is necessary to save lives from imminent destruction, is an obvious example.”
Boy: Mr. Owl, how many flicks of the bat does it take to get to the Nazi center of the Nazi pop?
Ben Owl: Let’s find out. One…
Enemy Noncombatant: Yowl!
Ben Owl: Two…
Enemy Noncombatant: Arrrghh!
Ben Owl: Three…
Enemy Noncombatant:
Ben Owl: Three
Narrator: How many flicks of the bat does it take to get to the Nazi center of the Nazi pop? The world of Ben Shapiro may never know.
Ben Owl: Let’s find out. One…
Enemy Noncombatant: Yowl!
Ben Owl: Two…
Enemy Noncombatant: Arrrghh!
Ben Owl: Three…
Enemy Noncombatant:
Ben Owl: Three
Narrator: How many flicks of the bat does it take to get to the Nazi center of the Nazi pop? The world of Ben Shapiro may never know.
So let me see if I have this right. Western civilization is so threatened (and presumably fragile) that we must be willing to do anything, including torture, to protect it. But at the same time, it’s not so fragile that engaging in torture (or anything else “we deem necessary”) will in any way erode our “civilization”……. If this country tortured people the way Ben S. tortures logic, we’d all be in a world of hurt…..
Young Ben has matriculated at two of our best institutions of higher learning, yet the experience seems, far from having rounded or broadened or enriched his intellect to have simply convinced him he needn’t bother to look. Sorry if I’m repeating myself; it just never ceases to amaze me. I trust daddy’s got a sinecure set up for him at some law firm; otherwise he’s going to wind up like most child actors.
s.z. writes: “I want to go get Jack Bauer and have him ‘persuade’ Ben to enlist in the infantry.”
FRONT LINE INFANTRY! FRONT LINE INFANTRY! FRONT LINE INFANTRY!
FRONT LINE INFANTRY! FRONT LINE INFANTRY! FRONT LINE INFANTRY!
d. sidhe writes: “Are you guys cracking down on my long-and-ranty-ness?”
You stop being long and ranty and I’ll be very unhappy. [winning smile]
You stop being long and ranty and I’ll be very unhappy. [winning smile]
I’m with FlipYrWhig on this one. Shapiro doesn’t seem to realize that just this argument was used to justify the persecution of the Jews. The Nazis, and European anti-Semites in general, didn’t recognize Jews as belonging to “Western Culture”.
In relation to the “Civil as long as they don’t threaten our civilization” quote, there’s a video of Hitler addressing the puppet “Nazi Parliament” where he declares that “If the Jews declare war on us we will destroy them”.
You’re in good company there, Shapiro!
In relation to the “Civil as long as they don’t threaten our civilization” quote, there’s a video of Hitler addressing the puppet “Nazi Parliament” where he declares that “If the Jews declare war on us we will destroy them”.
You’re in good company there, Shapiro!
More rightist masterbaiting – self-proprietary moral certainty happily discarded by the inner fascist’s moral relavitism and terminal uniqueness. If Ben-Putz went to public school he might not have “future war criminal” stamped on his soul.
I can’t believe this guy could get into Harvard. That so-called argument would have been laughed off my high school debate team. I guess they will let anyone in these days as long as the check clears. Ben needs to go back to being the virgin who writes about porn, because it makes more sense than being the sheltered nimrod who writes about foriegn policy.
Has anyone else noticed that a large number of wingnuts seem to have trouble distinguishing reality from an episode of 24? It’s slightly troubling.
straw man: n. An argument or opponent set up so as to be easily refuted or defeated. ex. No one doubts that arbitrary torture is wrong. Were we to pull random American citizens from their homes and drag them into a cell for a bit of waterboarding, we would undoubtedly be destroying our own moral fiber and discrediting our history.
Were we to pull random American citizens from their homes and drag them into a cell for a bit of waterboarding, we would undoubtedly be destroying our own moral fiber and discrediting our history… But there is a fundamental difference between our treatment of non-citizens and our treatment of citizens.
This righteous dude is happy with the idea of sweeping in non-citizens [e.g. me] for waterboarding. I am intrigued… no, “physically nauseated” is a more accurate phrase. I can only deduce that when citizens are tortured, their pain-racked bodies exude some sort of chemical that rots moral fibre, whereas non-citizens lack this useful biological defense.
This righteous dude is happy with the idea of sweeping in non-citizens [e.g. me] for waterboarding. I am intrigued… no, “physically nauseated” is a more accurate phrase. I can only deduce that when citizens are tortured, their pain-racked bodies exude some sort of chemical that rots moral fibre, whereas non-citizens lack this useful biological defense.
“But there is a fundamental difference between our treatment of non-citizens and our treatment of citizens.”
I read something like this and I want to scream. It has taken human beings so long to get as far as they have to come out of the moral mud even a little. The actual concept that there are inherent human rights ( I think Spinoza was the first to even really suggest it) is so new. The concept of universal human rights extending to all people is – what? – 1949. There can’t be distinctions between citizens and non-citizens in the area of basic human rights, or rights are nothing more than something that a government entity can simply grant or withdraw as it pleases. What Shapiro is saying undercuts and denies the entire basis for the American experiment. The contradiction at the heart of his article really reveals either the most blatant stupidity or the most despicable sophistry.
“We will not become Nazis because we torture terrorists”
Yes we will.
I read something like this and I want to scream. It has taken human beings so long to get as far as they have to come out of the moral mud even a little. The actual concept that there are inherent human rights ( I think Spinoza was the first to even really suggest it) is so new. The concept of universal human rights extending to all people is – what? – 1949. There can’t be distinctions between citizens and non-citizens in the area of basic human rights, or rights are nothing more than something that a government entity can simply grant or withdraw as it pleases. What Shapiro is saying undercuts and denies the entire basis for the American experiment. The contradiction at the heart of his article really reveals either the most blatant stupidity or the most despicable sophistry.
“We will not become Nazis because we torture terrorists”
Yes we will.
tomg, it does leave you wondering about that “all men are created equal, endowed with certain rights” thing. Maybe Ben skipped that day in civics class?
The really sickening part, to me, is that he presents this as though it were entirely hypothetical. Like it hasn’t actually happened. Like what we do to human beings is merely a thought exercise.
We’re right back to that “fiction vs. reality” thing again. It gets more surreal every time I see it.
Herr Doktor, that would at least be a possible if false explanation for VBen’s callous viciousness. I suspect he doesn’t have even that much mistaken logic behind it.
The really sickening part, to me, is that he presents this as though it were entirely hypothetical. Like it hasn’t actually happened. Like what we do to human beings is merely a thought exercise.
We’re right back to that “fiction vs. reality” thing again. It gets more surreal every time I see it.
Herr Doktor, that would at least be a possible if false explanation for VBen’s callous viciousness. I suspect he doesn’t have even that much mistaken logic behind it.
Well, we are left with the hope that VBen will go to work for one of these white-shoe law firms, spending 70 hours a week sticking red dots on documents in the library, and thus leaving him no time to craft such finely nuanced arguments.
Aren’t I uncurably optimistic? VBen does not “craft.” He sits down and the nasty just oozes out of him and into the keyboard.
Aren’t I uncurably optimistic? VBen does not “craft.” He sits down and the nasty just oozes out of him and into the keyboard.
Jumpin’ Jebus, Lil’ Ben is such a big pud for his lil’ britches! And, D., what’s all this concern about ticking IUD’s?
D. Sidhe –
Wingnut commentators always abstract away the real world. I often get the feeling they consider only themselves fully human, and the rest of us are some sort of lesser being, good only to try out their thought experiments on. In that aspect, they are much like the Nazis.
Wingnut commentators always abstract away the real world. I often get the feeling they consider only themselves fully human, and the rest of us are some sort of lesser being, good only to try out their thought experiments on. In that aspect, they are much like the Nazis.
Off topic, but reminiscent of yesterday’s fun with the religious so-far-right-they’re-almost-left-behind site. The chaps at Sadly, No steered me to Shelley the Republican who might be worth some of your attention. This stuff is FUNNY!
http://www.shelleytherepublican.com/
Do turn your sound off, though. There’s a repeated 3-tone chime that will make your eardrums twitch.
http://www.shelleytherepublican.com/
Do turn your sound off, though. There’s a repeated 3-tone chime that will make your eardrums twitch.
Bill S’s point is well taken. VBen would probably get fragged. The horror….
All I can add is this: If you have to use a non-event (arbitrary torture) to premise your argument, your argument is worth fuck-all. Torture is NEVER arbitrary, even when it is not state-sponsored.
tomg, it does leave you wondering about that “all men are created equal, endowed with certain rights” thing. Maybe Ben skipped that day in civics class?
His education has also omitted Filártiga v. Peña-Irala. “The crime of torture can be tried in the US even if the act of torture did not occur within US boundaries, and neither the victim nor the torturer is a US citizen.”
His education has also omitted Filártiga v. Peña-Irala. “The crime of torture can be tried in the US even if the act of torture did not occur within US boundaries, and neither the victim nor the torturer is a US citizen.”
You gotta see http://www.shelleytherepublican.com as recommended by Marion from Savannah. Rarely does one come across such a rich ore of wingnuttery. Marion, you have truly hit the motherlode. I think the bit about “Jesus wants you to have a gun” is priceless.
Ben Shapiro has some interesting predecessors concerning the topic of preserving one’s moral integrity despite torture/murder.
Himmler, speaking to SS officers, Poznan, Poland, october 4 1943, on how great it is that they can kill Jews “without destroying that which makes us what we are.” :
And none of them has seen it, has endured it. Most of you will know what it means when 100 bodies lie together, when there are 500, or when there are 1000. And to have seen this through, and — with the exception of human weaknesses — to have remained decent, has made us hard and is a page of glory never mentioned and never to be mentioned.
Colonel Kurtz, Apocalypse Now :
These were men…trained cadres…these men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love…but they had the strength…the strength…to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral…and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordal instincts to kill without feeling…without passion…
Himmler, speaking to SS officers, Poznan, Poland, october 4 1943, on how great it is that they can kill Jews “without destroying that which makes us what we are.” :
And none of them has seen it, has endured it. Most of you will know what it means when 100 bodies lie together, when there are 500, or when there are 1000. And to have seen this through, and — with the exception of human weaknesses — to have remained decent, has made us hard and is a page of glory never mentioned and never to be mentioned.
Colonel Kurtz, Apocalypse Now :
These were men…trained cadres…these men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love…but they had the strength…the strength…to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral…and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordal instincts to kill without feeling…without passion…
You folks are right about shelleytherepublican.com. Rarely have I seen such a collection of poorly spelled, out-of-right-field hate babblings and incorrect information posted in the same place.
To cite just one, no, two examples (I’m restraining myself), Shelley says that Gov. Tom Vilsack (D-IA) was born out of wedlock. (She skips over who adopted him.) Well, if so, what of it? Isn’t BushCo really big on adoption? Don’t Mr./Mrs. Marvin Bush have two adopted kids?
Shelley also puts “Governor” in quotation marks, as though she can’t bear to grant Vilsack electoral legitimacy.
She also questions the death by heart attack, some thirty years ago, of Rep. Phil Burton (D-CA). His missus took his seat in the House, and died of cancer three years later. Foul play is suggested by Shelley, though not a scrap of supporting evidence. (How does someone GIVE someone else cancer? I mean, apart from unwittingly sexually transmitted human papilloma virus; HPV can morph into cervical cancer. However, none of us knew about this connection until recently.)
Shelley does, however, give frequent wet cyberkisses to W., who botched every business in which he ever became involved. No mention of mysterious deaths with which his family has been involved… for example, how Marvin Bush’s nanny/housekeeper was run over and killed in the family’s own driveway. The Washington Post took nearly a week to cover the story, very minimally, with no follow-up. And we all know how W. got into office in 2000. Divine right, Shelley might say…
Anyway, despite the nasty juju emanating from Shelley and her band of monkeys pounding away at their keyboards, I imagine I’ll go back from time to time. You can remedy the soiled sensation from visiting her column by washing your hands thoroughly, and drinking a tall glass of freshly squeezed citrus juice.
To cite just one, no, two examples (I’m restraining myself), Shelley says that Gov. Tom Vilsack (D-IA) was born out of wedlock. (She skips over who adopted him.) Well, if so, what of it? Isn’t BushCo really big on adoption? Don’t Mr./Mrs. Marvin Bush have two adopted kids?
Shelley also puts “Governor” in quotation marks, as though she can’t bear to grant Vilsack electoral legitimacy.
She also questions the death by heart attack, some thirty years ago, of Rep. Phil Burton (D-CA). His missus took his seat in the House, and died of cancer three years later. Foul play is suggested by Shelley, though not a scrap of supporting evidence. (How does someone GIVE someone else cancer? I mean, apart from unwittingly sexually transmitted human papilloma virus; HPV can morph into cervical cancer. However, none of us knew about this connection until recently.)
Shelley does, however, give frequent wet cyberkisses to W., who botched every business in which he ever became involved. No mention of mysterious deaths with which his family has been involved… for example, how Marvin Bush’s nanny/housekeeper was run over and killed in the family’s own driveway. The Washington Post took nearly a week to cover the story, very minimally, with no follow-up. And we all know how W. got into office in 2000. Divine right, Shelley might say…
Anyway, despite the nasty juju emanating from Shelley and her band of monkeys pounding away at their keyboards, I imagine I’ll go back from time to time. You can remedy the soiled sensation from visiting her column by washing your hands thoroughly, and drinking a tall glass of freshly squeezed citrus juice.
I was particularly impressed with the neural pathways needed to put this into print:
No one doubts that arbitrary torture is wrong. Were we to pull random American citizens from their homes and drag them into a cell for a bit of waterboarding, we would undoubtedly be destroying our own moral fiber and discrediting our history.
Jose Padilla, anyone?
No one doubts that arbitrary torture is wrong. Were we to pull random American citizens from their homes and drag them into a cell for a bit of waterboarding, we would undoubtedly be destroying our own moral fiber and discrediting our history.
Jose Padilla, anyone?
“Young Ben has matriculated at two of our best institutions of higher learning, yet the experience seems, far from having rounded or broadened or enriched his intellect to have simply convinced him he needn’t bother to look. ”
Sounds suspiciously like someone residing in the White House. Is Ben a legacy admission of some sort?
Sounds suspiciously like someone residing in the White House. Is Ben a legacy admission of some sort?
*try saying “infantile imbecile” 10 times, really fast.