I don’t know about you, but I had a hard day warring on Christmas today. First, I visited a lady with cancer who is currently undergoing chemo, and made arrangements to take her to the nursing home tomorrow to see her husband who is suffering from Alzheimer’s. We laughed together over her new hairstyle, I commiserated with her over her nausea and weakness, and we talked hopefully about better times in the future. She thanked me for the visit and for the little Santa teddy bear I had got her from the Dollar Store. Then I punched her in the gut because she didn’t wish me a “Merry Christmas.”
Next, I went to Sam’s Club and bought a large bag of Meow Mix for Shirley’s cats. Shirley, who lives across the street from my parents, is on welfare and has been having some serious health problems for a while. Her cats, which live outside and prowl the neighborhood, have been looking kinda thin and raggedy lately. So, to make me feel better, I spent $9 to buy them some food.
After ringing up my purchase and taking my money, the cashier smiled and thanked me for shopping there — but she didn’t wish me a “Merry Christmas,” so I slapped her.
After exiting the store, I gave a few bucks to the college students who were there collecting for the community food bank. They didn’t wish me a “Merry Christmas” either, so I decked them.
Then I went to Shirley’s house, put out food for the cats, and visited with Shirley for a few minutes. She was clearly touched that somebody cared about her and her cats, and thanked my several times for the cat food – but she didn’t wish me a “Merry Christmas, so I broke her thumbs.
On the way home, I stopped to see drop off some cookies I had bought for my neighbor Linda at the new Mexican bakery in town (of course, nobody THERE said “Merry Christmas” to me, so I was forced to torch their business). Linda has lost control of much of her body due to the ravages of MS, and finds it hard to speak. She did manage to tell me a little about her black cat, to tell me about what she was watching on TV (“Little House on the Prairie”), and to thank me for the cookies, but … well, you can guess the rest.
Then I came home, scooped out litter boxes, refilled water bowels, and took the dogs for a walk. I considered feeding the creatures, but they attacked me viciously by failing to say anything to me about my most cherished holiday, so they can all starve until the give me my props!
Finally, after reading Scott’s eloquent post about Annti and Lee, I did what he suggested and sent a few dollars to help Lee. While it took me only seconds to do, and was a really easy way to help someone who truly deserved it, the PayPal receipt did NOT even bid me a Festive Noel! I still haven’t decided now to avenge this act of war.
However, a visit to the Save Christmas In MA from Brad at Sadly, No! site brightened my spirits. It seems that Catholic Online did an update on the Marley brother’s efforts (“‘Scrooge stores’ hit by Coalition to Save Christmas,” and the story included this amusing passage:
A bit later in the piece, we learn about the kind of take-charge leaders we have here in America:
However, the best thing I learned from visiting the SaveChristmas site tonight is that people in high places are now possibly checking out Bob’s web site, seeing his endorsement of World O’Crap, and reading our blog.
Here’s how Bob broke the good news to his followers:
Next, I went to Sam’s Club and bought a large bag of Meow Mix for Shirley’s cats. Shirley, who lives across the street from my parents, is on welfare and has been having some serious health problems for a while. Her cats, which live outside and prowl the neighborhood, have been looking kinda thin and raggedy lately. So, to make me feel better, I spent $9 to buy them some food.
After ringing up my purchase and taking my money, the cashier smiled and thanked me for shopping there — but she didn’t wish me a “Merry Christmas,” so I slapped her.
After exiting the store, I gave a few bucks to the college students who were there collecting for the community food bank. They didn’t wish me a “Merry Christmas” either, so I decked them.
Then I went to Shirley’s house, put out food for the cats, and visited with Shirley for a few minutes. She was clearly touched that somebody cared about her and her cats, and thanked my several times for the cat food – but she didn’t wish me a “Merry Christmas, so I broke her thumbs.
On the way home, I stopped to see drop off some cookies I had bought for my neighbor Linda at the new Mexican bakery in town (of course, nobody THERE said “Merry Christmas” to me, so I was forced to torch their business). Linda has lost control of much of her body due to the ravages of MS, and finds it hard to speak. She did manage to tell me a little about her black cat, to tell me about what she was watching on TV (“Little House on the Prairie”), and to thank me for the cookies, but … well, you can guess the rest.
Then I came home, scooped out litter boxes, refilled water bowels, and took the dogs for a walk. I considered feeding the creatures, but they attacked me viciously by failing to say anything to me about my most cherished holiday, so they can all starve until the give me my props!
Finally, after reading Scott’s eloquent post about Annti and Lee, I did what he suggested and sent a few dollars to help Lee. While it took me only seconds to do, and was a really easy way to help someone who truly deserved it, the PayPal receipt did NOT even bid me a Festive Noel! I still haven’t decided now to avenge this act of war.
However, a visit to the Save Christmas In MA from Brad at Sadly, No! site brightened my spirits. It seems that Catholic Online did an update on the Marley brother’s efforts (“‘Scrooge stores’ hit by Coalition to Save Christmas,” and the story included this amusing passage:
Philanthropist and real estate developer Thomas J. Flatley of Milton, Mass., called to offer his help.Um, because our country is called “The United States of Jesus”? Or is it because we believe in Christ, unlike the pagan Russianns or heathen Italians?
“I think they’re very courageous,” Flatley said in an interview with The Anchor, the Fall River, Mass., diocesan newspaper. “I’d be thrilled to have my name affiliated with anything that has to do with Christ. Why do you think this country has never had a Stalin or a Mussolini?”
A bit later in the piece, we learn about the kind of take-charge leaders we have here in America:
“I’m always telling my kids not to cave into peer pressure,” said Mr. [Robert] Marley, who describes himself as a “field marshal type” organizer.After all, that’s how Mussolini got the trains to run on time.
His marching orders to consumers: “Don’t sit back and complain. It takes five minutes. Pick up the phone, go online, find a company’s CEO and barrage him with emails.”
However, the best thing I learned from visiting the SaveChristmas site tonight is that people in high places are now possibly checking out Bob’s web site, seeing his endorsement of World O’Crap, and reading our blog.
Here’s how Bob broke the good news to his followers:
Today 12/05/2006 we made International News Click linkYes, he certainly must — I’m sure he has nothing better to do than to read little stories in “Catholic Online” about guys in MA who are fighting Toys ‘R Us for Jesus. (I bet the Pope is even considering canonizing these Christmas Crusaders for the great work they’ve done on behalf of Christendom by pestering mall supervisors with their greeting demands). But thank heavens this Pope hails from Germany or Mr. Flatley might be in trouble for his crack about how we Americans are way more Christian than those godless Italians.
http://www.catholic.org/international/international_story.php?id=22234
Look to the right of the story and click #6 for another story. We are getting more attention than we ever dreamed. The Pope must be aware of our crusade.
76 Responses to “Warring on Christmas is Almost as Hard as Presidenting”
:::bows before the Mistress Of All That Is Good And Actually GETS SHIT *DONE*, as in ACTUALLY HELPING CRITTERS AND PEOPLE ALIKE, unlike just about every fucking organized religion on this fucking PLANET:::
I am but a young(ish) accolyte at thy feet, Madame/Saint S.Z. — teach me your ways, and sure as hell teach me how you find the energy to be our own personal Wonder Woman, ’cause I *so* wanna be you if I ever grow up.
I am but a young(ish) accolyte at thy feet, Madame/Saint S.Z. — teach me your ways, and sure as hell teach me how you find the energy to be our own personal Wonder Woman, ’cause I *so* wanna be you if I ever grow up.
“I think they’re very courageous”
Ah, yes, the courage it takes to protect a holiday nearly everybody celebrates in some fashion in a country where you believe ninety percent of the people are your religion to begin with. Those brave, brave souls.
Ah, yes, the courage it takes to protect a holiday nearly everybody celebrates in some fashion in a country where you believe ninety percent of the people are your religion to begin with. Those brave, brave souls.
“I’d be thrilled to have my name affiliated with anything that has to do with Christ. Why do you think this country has never had a Stalin or a Mussolini?”
I don’t know. Maybe it’s because our country is biased against guys with moustaches or against portly bald guys. I mean we never elected Groucho Marx or Dave Attell ( who actually looks a little like Benito) either. Or maybe it’s because our country is dominated by the two-party system and they couldn’t get in the debates. Or maybe it’s because your name has never been affiliated with Christ, although of the three, the last seems least likely. Their non sequiturs don’t even make sense as non sequiturs.
I don’t know. Maybe it’s because our country is biased against guys with moustaches or against portly bald guys. I mean we never elected Groucho Marx or Dave Attell ( who actually looks a little like Benito) either. Or maybe it’s because our country is dominated by the two-party system and they couldn’t get in the debates. Or maybe it’s because your name has never been affiliated with Christ, although of the three, the last seems least likely. Their non sequiturs don’t even make sense as non sequiturs.
I see a lot of rage over a simple cause like saving Christmas, however, where is your sanctimonious rage when a black muslim stands up in America and calls for the extermination of the white race, globally I might add with out consequence. It is the arrogant ramblings of your ilk that creates a forum for such audacity. You will be the undoing of us all.
Merry Merry Merry Christmas
Merry Merry Merry Christmas
You “guys” should put your heads together and come up with one unified post instead of giving everyone 90 seconds at the computer to type whatever comes into each head.
Hey, it’s the Plagiarism Guys, who apparently have an enormous amount of time on their hands to Google quotes about liberals and re-post them without attribution. Attaboys! (I recognize the plagiarism the same way I recognize it in my students’ writing: the words are spelled and used correctly, and the sentences make syntactic sense, none of which matches the previously established writing style we’ve come to love so much.)
“I see a lot of rage over a simple cause like saving Christmas, however, where is your sanctimonious rage when a black muslim stands up in America and calls for the extermination of the white race, globally I might add with out consequence”
We’re not the ones boycotting and name calling and acting like tantrummy little toddlers because the big bad big box retailers didn’t say the proper, empty, meaningless greeting.
As to this mystery muslim, so what if we, The LEFT didn’t rise up with one voice to condemn him? Most blatantly stupid shit doesn’t require a specific condemnation, it is self evident that it is stupid. Plenty of uber-rightwing White Supremecist cretards have called for the extermination of all non-whites. That doesn’t mean all people right of center are somehow obligated to denounce it. Unless, of course, the person saying it is an elected official, party leader or otherwise well known mainstream figure. None of which, I imagine, applies to the phantom scary Muslim you keep trying to dun us with.
We’re not the ones boycotting and name calling and acting like tantrummy little toddlers because the big bad big box retailers didn’t say the proper, empty, meaningless greeting.
As to this mystery muslim, so what if we, The LEFT didn’t rise up with one voice to condemn him? Most blatantly stupid shit doesn’t require a specific condemnation, it is self evident that it is stupid. Plenty of uber-rightwing White Supremecist cretards have called for the extermination of all non-whites. That doesn’t mean all people right of center are somehow obligated to denounce it. Unless, of course, the person saying it is an elected official, party leader or otherwise well known mainstream figure. None of which, I imagine, applies to the phantom scary Muslim you keep trying to dun us with.
Hey Christmas Guys,
I love the Roland Barthes quotation – he really is still one of my favorite theorists.
The Spiro Agnew is, well, Spiro Agnew. Do you characters even know who Lionel Trilling is? For that matter, without going to some quotation site could you even recognize the Trilling quote. You might, however, be interested in Trilling’s comment that conservatives had no ideas “just irritable mental gestures.”
I love the Roland Barthes quotation – he really is still one of my favorite theorists.
The Spiro Agnew is, well, Spiro Agnew. Do you characters even know who Lionel Trilling is? For that matter, without going to some quotation site could you even recognize the Trilling quote. You might, however, be interested in Trilling’s comment that conservatives had no ideas “just irritable mental gestures.”
Oh, and Guys, it’s “Ann” Coulter, not Anne. If you’re going to proclaim your love for someone, at least try to get their name right.
We like to plagiarize, we don’t have to be to analytical of you guys because you have a category all your own. Therefore, with our busy schedule, it allows us to give homage to those wise people, and allows us to reiterate quickly, what is already known but might have been forgotten. Now this just wasted 2 minutes of my valuable time.
“Now this just wasted 2 minutes of my valuable time.”
Ha! You really are a funny guy! Zing! Pow!
Ha! You really are a funny guy! Zing! Pow!
To us its Anne.
I hope everyone here has a Merry Christmas, warmest regards
I hope everyone here has a Merry Christmas, warmest regards
I think TCGs are really Gary Ruppert. Or a bot of some kind…
Did you all even GET the point of the post? While you’re all congratulating yourselves and thinking of yourself as most holy, because your boycotting stores who don’t wish you “Merry Christmas”, even thinking that the POPE knows about you and is impressed…well. You really don’t get it.
Look at it this way. Let’s imagine the pope is given two news articles. One is about a couple guys who are boycotting stores who aren’t going to stop using “Happy Holidays”; the other is about two women who, inspite of physical and health issues, have gone out of their way time and time again to help the poor, the sick, the suffering.
Now seriously–Which group of people would he really be more impressed with?
That’s what we are saying–we are saying that there is NO war on christmas simply because some stores use the word “Holiday” instead of christmas (just as there isn’t a war on hanukkah because no one wishes me a happy one of those, either. and I live in a Jewish neighborhood for criminey sakes!).
The day itself isn’t made or broken by the use of a single word. It will be made or broken by what people choose to do in living by the spirit of the man the holiday is now known for; rather than trying to save a holiday that is in no danger at all, use your website to save lives. Set up links that will allow your readers to send money to any of the Catholic charities that are out there–I know you know of some.
And for the love of God–stop making yourselves feel all holy and wonderful because you are trying to force people to say “Merry Christmas” to you. Because right now, that’s what it looks like the “War On Xmas” boils down to; and that makes you all look like infants.
Did you all even GET the point of the post? While you’re all congratulating yourselves and thinking of yourself as most holy, because your boycotting stores who don’t wish you “Merry Christmas”, even thinking that the POPE knows about you and is impressed…well. You really don’t get it.
Look at it this way. Let’s imagine the pope is given two news articles. One is about a couple guys who are boycotting stores who aren’t going to stop using “Happy Holidays”; the other is about two women who, inspite of physical and health issues, have gone out of their way time and time again to help the poor, the sick, the suffering.
Now seriously–Which group of people would he really be more impressed with?
That’s what we are saying–we are saying that there is NO war on christmas simply because some stores use the word “Holiday” instead of christmas (just as there isn’t a war on hanukkah because no one wishes me a happy one of those, either. and I live in a Jewish neighborhood for criminey sakes!).
The day itself isn’t made or broken by the use of a single word. It will be made or broken by what people choose to do in living by the spirit of the man the holiday is now known for; rather than trying to save a holiday that is in no danger at all, use your website to save lives. Set up links that will allow your readers to send money to any of the Catholic charities that are out there–I know you know of some.
And for the love of God–stop making yourselves feel all holy and wonderful because you are trying to force people to say “Merry Christmas” to you. Because right now, that’s what it looks like the “War On Xmas” boils down to; and that makes you all look like infants.
“Now this just wasted 2 minutes of my valuable time.”
Time that they need to continue trolling lefty blogs and posting quotes without giving credit to the actual people who wrote the quotes!
These are busy busy guys!
Time that they need to continue trolling lefty blogs and posting quotes without giving credit to the actual people who wrote the quotes!
These are busy busy guys!
Thanks Brian, for me this is all in fun, however, some people here get pretty mad at me. Moreover, if they were not being so nasty, I never would have said a word, but my 12-year-old nephew happened across the world of garbage and was confronted with some pretty nasty things. A lot of children are enthused by our effort and in that enthusiasm they have come across this site, many children. Prior to me linking it to our site, the kids had already discovered it. Now the parents can block it when they are done viewing it.
.
.
“The petty are without pity, the chastising are without charity, the arrogant are without intelligence, and the liberals own in title the aforementioned” Quote by Bob Marley
There you go, I created a new quote for you.
There you go, I created a new quote for you.
You guys are the lamest liars–ever.
First you scroll troll with uncredited quotes, then you claim to like “Anne” but obviously have no prior knowledge of her (other than in passing) or you would have known how she spells it(and for the record, I know her as Anthony. But that’s another story). And finally you claim kids are finding this site on their own. I would love to know how. What are they googling for when they stumble across it, and why would they stay when it obviously wasn’t what they were looking for?
You know, lying is a venial sin in the Catholic Church. Better go to confession before you do it again.
First you scroll troll with uncredited quotes, then you claim to like “Anne” but obviously have no prior knowledge of her (other than in passing) or you would have known how she spells it(and for the record, I know her as Anthony. But that’s another story). And finally you claim kids are finding this site on their own. I would love to know how. What are they googling for when they stumble across it, and why would they stay when it obviously wasn’t what they were looking for?
You know, lying is a venial sin in the Catholic Church. Better go to confession before you do it again.
“Yea, those who would follow me must be willing to forsake all and to stand alone if they would inherit the kingdom of my Father. Or if not forsake all, at least be willing to berate a $6.00/hr Walmart clerk for not properly venerating My birthday” – Jesus
“The petty are without pity”
Like I said, who’s throwing the hissy fit about two words? And let me clairify: I don’t care if someone says Merry Christmas or not, since I’m going to have one regardless. My faith and beliefs are strong enough to withstand them not being affirmed by the Kwik-e-mart clerk.
“the chastising are without charity”
You really didn’t read S.Z. post that this thread is attached to, did you?
“the arrogant are without intelligence”
We’re not the ones claiming to have the ear of the Pope.
Like I said, who’s throwing the hissy fit about two words? And let me clairify: I don’t care if someone says Merry Christmas or not, since I’m going to have one regardless. My faith and beliefs are strong enough to withstand them not being affirmed by the Kwik-e-mart clerk.
“the chastising are without charity”
You really didn’t read S.Z. post that this thread is attached to, did you?
“the arrogant are without intelligence”
We’re not the ones claiming to have the ear of the Pope.
Hey Crumpet or dumpit, what ever it is , I’m talking about the Conservative Ann Coulter, you know, your arch enemy, the one you people like to spit at and throw things at, that one, not some guy hiding behind a woman’s name, but thanks for the heads-up on that one. (:
Brian, you don’t think the pope reads the Catholic papers? This story has been in every Catholic paper in the country. However, now the story is international, I’d say that is pretty significant.
And for all those who put forth that misleading propaganda, that there is no war on Christmas in order to hide the fact that there is, I suggest you check The United States District Court docket in you area. Or the Appellate Court dockets.
Merry Christmas
And for all those who put forth that misleading propaganda, that there is no war on Christmas in order to hide the fact that there is, I suggest you check The United States District Court docket in you area. Or the Appellate Court dockets.
Merry Christmas
I never would have said a word, but my 12-year-old nephew happened across the world of garbage and was confronted with some pretty nasty things.
The truth, like your wives, is never pretty…
The truth, like your wives, is never pretty…
Smatter, Christmas Guys…couldn’t you answer my simple questions?
—————————
Also why should it bother you if we want Christmas restored to the public?
Left by The Christmas Guys
When was it taken?
Seriously. When did the networks STOP showing A Charlie Brown Christmas in favor of Omar’s Eid-ul-Fitr? Or Moishe’s Hannukah?
When?
When did Sears stop showing Christmas trees and Santas?
When?
Why is it so wrong to include the other small percentage of the country who also celebrate a holiday this time of year? If your sister married a Jew or a Muslim, or a black (I know, shuddering in your hood, aintcha?), you’d go out of your way to be polite and do SOMETHING inclusive, wouldn’t you?
So lemme ask you something: when did America stop being a family?
————————–
Too hard for you? I can put it in words of one syllable for you, and even translate it into “FReeper”, if that will help you…
—————————
Also why should it bother you if we want Christmas restored to the public?
Left by The Christmas Guys
When was it taken?
Seriously. When did the networks STOP showing A Charlie Brown Christmas in favor of Omar’s Eid-ul-Fitr? Or Moishe’s Hannukah?
When?
When did Sears stop showing Christmas trees and Santas?
When?
Why is it so wrong to include the other small percentage of the country who also celebrate a holiday this time of year? If your sister married a Jew or a Muslim, or a black (I know, shuddering in your hood, aintcha?), you’d go out of your way to be polite and do SOMETHING inclusive, wouldn’t you?
So lemme ask you something: when did America stop being a family?
————————–
Too hard for you? I can put it in words of one syllable for you, and even translate it into “FReeper”, if that will help you…
You know one of the things I really like about Christmas — oops, I mean The Holidays — is that you can decorate your tree with nice ornaments. Why, I just saw a whole box full of cute little men made of straw…..
Can someone please explain to me exactly what it is that Christmas needs saving from? Is Christmas somehow in danger of falling off our radar? Seriously — are people going to forget it’s Christmas if they’re not constantly reminded of it? (Not that that’s even possible — you can’t go into a store this month without being incessantly bombarded with Christmas music.)
I just don’t get it.
I just don’t get it.
All I want for Christmas is for Father O’Reilly to take his hand outta my pants.
bots
And for all those who put forth that misleading propaganda, that there is no war on Christmas in order to hide the fact that there is, I suggest you check The United States District Court docket in you area. Or the Appellate Court dockets.
Well, looking at the cases around here, apparently there’s a War on Stealing Cars and a War on Dealing Crack and a War on Being Poor and Black, but no War on Christmas.
Well, looking at the cases around here, apparently there’s a War on Stealing Cars and a War on Dealing Crack and a War on Being Poor and Black, but no War on Christmas.
Just because His Holiness is aware of something, doesn’t mean he cares. Or approves. I’m waiting for an encyclical on the subject. I suspect I’ll be waiting a long time.
And just what am I supposed to be looking for in the court dockets? Liberals v. Christmas? Secular Progressives v. All Things Good, Holy et. al.?
Here’s a radical idea: why don’t you provide an actual court case where some evil liberal is suing to eliminate all references to Christmas? I am waiting with bated breath…
And just what am I supposed to be looking for in the court dockets? Liberals v. Christmas? Secular Progressives v. All Things Good, Holy et. al.?
Here’s a radical idea: why don’t you provide an actual court case where some evil liberal is suing to eliminate all references to Christmas? I am waiting with bated breath…
I’d quote TCG, but why bother? It’s obvious from his asinine assertions that he has never, once, actually met a liberal. He’s only familiar with the Limbaugh/Coulter/Hannity/etc. demonized portrayal thereof. And, yeah, if you slurp-up that B.S., it tastes pretty crappy. But don’t confuse this odd fantasyland, where you have to be brave to be a Christian (in your 12, 000-member evangellical mega-church) with reality. Those people must be huffing rubber cement. Do I hate them? No. Do I laugh at them, because they’re pathetic jerks? Well, yeah. Who wouldn’t?
First S.Z. I wouldn’t know how to spam anything. What I have to say I will say right here like I have. I’m right here in the open, I use my real name,I don’t hide behind some fake scree name.
Case on point. Now this should keep the readers busy for a minute while I dig up the latest cases pending before the courts.
Florey v. Sioux Falls School District (1980)
Roger Florey, an atheist, filed suit against a local school district’s holiday programs, claiming that singing of religious carols during Christmas concerts, like “Silent Night” and “O Come All Ye Faithful,” were a violation of the separation of church and state.
Lynch v. Donnelly (1983)
The Supreme Court ruled 5-4 that the city of Pawtucket could continue to display a nativity scene as part of its Christmas display.
County of Allegheny v. ACLU Greater Pittsburgh Chapter (1989)
The Supreme Court ruled that while a creche display on public property was unconstitutional, a menorah display on another piece of public property was not.
Bridenbaugh v. O’Bannon (1993)
According to the Seventh Circuit Court of Appeals, a government is permitted to give employees a religious holiday off as a paid vacation day, but only if the government can provide a legitimate secular purpose for choosing that day instead of any other day.
Clever v. Cherry Hill Township (1993)
How far can a public school go when including religious symbols in school functions? According to a New Jersey District Court, any religious symbols can be used, but only so long as they are part of a legitimate, secular education program.
Capitol Square Review Board v. Pinette (1995)
Supreme Court decision holding that an unattended cross erected by the KKK on public grounds would not give the impression of government endorsement and, hence, is not a violation of the separation of church and state.
Metzl v. Leininger (1995)
Andrea Metzl, an Illinois public school teacher, filed a lawsuit to prevent the state of Illinois from (among other things) using of public funds derived from taxes that she paid to pay teachers for the Good Friday holiday.
Bauchman v. West High School (1997)
Is it a violation of the separation of church and state to make students sing Christian songs in a public school choir? According to the 10th Circuit Court of Appeals, it isn’t a violation – not even if the teacher involved uses his position to promote his religion.
Ganulin v. United States (1999)
Is it constitutional for the United States government to recognize Christmas as an official paid holiday? Richard Ganulin, an atheist lawyer, argued that it isn’t and filed suit, but a U.S. District Court ruled against him.
ACLU v. Schundler (1999)
The Third Circuit Court of Appeals found that a city’s crèche and menorah display was unconstitutional when it did not have any secular symbols with it, but it became constitutional when enough secular symbols were added to a new, modified display.
Granzeier v. Middleton (1999)
Can the government take a religious holiday and make an official state holiday out of it? Is it an establishment of religion when a religious holy day becomes an official state holiday? Good Friday is a Christian Holy Day which many Christians would surely like to have off, but does that mean that governments should grant it official recognition over and above the holy days of other religions?
Koenick v. Felton (1999)
Judith M. Koenick, a former public school teacher, filed suit against the Board of Education of Montgomery County, Maryland, challenging the constitutionality of a Maryland statute providing for public school holidays on the Friday before Easter through the Monday following.
Sechler v. State College Area School District (2000)
Jarrod Sechler, a “youth pastor” at a local Christian church, filed suit against the State College Area High School because their holiday program was insufficiently Christian for him. According to a U.S. District Court, the presence of non-Christian symbols did not advance either those religions or express hostility
Case on point. Now this should keep the readers busy for a minute while I dig up the latest cases pending before the courts.
Florey v. Sioux Falls School District (1980)
Roger Florey, an atheist, filed suit against a local school district’s holiday programs, claiming that singing of religious carols during Christmas concerts, like “Silent Night” and “O Come All Ye Faithful,” were a violation of the separation of church and state.
Lynch v. Donnelly (1983)
The Supreme Court ruled 5-4 that the city of Pawtucket could continue to display a nativity scene as part of its Christmas display.
County of Allegheny v. ACLU Greater Pittsburgh Chapter (1989)
The Supreme Court ruled that while a creche display on public property was unconstitutional, a menorah display on another piece of public property was not.
Bridenbaugh v. O’Bannon (1993)
According to the Seventh Circuit Court of Appeals, a government is permitted to give employees a religious holiday off as a paid vacation day, but only if the government can provide a legitimate secular purpose for choosing that day instead of any other day.
Clever v. Cherry Hill Township (1993)
How far can a public school go when including religious symbols in school functions? According to a New Jersey District Court, any religious symbols can be used, but only so long as they are part of a legitimate, secular education program.
Capitol Square Review Board v. Pinette (1995)
Supreme Court decision holding that an unattended cross erected by the KKK on public grounds would not give the impression of government endorsement and, hence, is not a violation of the separation of church and state.
Metzl v. Leininger (1995)
Andrea Metzl, an Illinois public school teacher, filed a lawsuit to prevent the state of Illinois from (among other things) using of public funds derived from taxes that she paid to pay teachers for the Good Friday holiday.
Bauchman v. West High School (1997)
Is it a violation of the separation of church and state to make students sing Christian songs in a public school choir? According to the 10th Circuit Court of Appeals, it isn’t a violation – not even if the teacher involved uses his position to promote his religion.
Ganulin v. United States (1999)
Is it constitutional for the United States government to recognize Christmas as an official paid holiday? Richard Ganulin, an atheist lawyer, argued that it isn’t and filed suit, but a U.S. District Court ruled against him.
ACLU v. Schundler (1999)
The Third Circuit Court of Appeals found that a city’s crèche and menorah display was unconstitutional when it did not have any secular symbols with it, but it became constitutional when enough secular symbols were added to a new, modified display.
Granzeier v. Middleton (1999)
Can the government take a religious holiday and make an official state holiday out of it? Is it an establishment of religion when a religious holy day becomes an official state holiday? Good Friday is a Christian Holy Day which many Christians would surely like to have off, but does that mean that governments should grant it official recognition over and above the holy days of other religions?
Koenick v. Felton (1999)
Judith M. Koenick, a former public school teacher, filed suit against the Board of Education of Montgomery County, Maryland, challenging the constitutionality of a Maryland statute providing for public school holidays on the Friday before Easter through the Monday following.
Sechler v. State College Area School District (2000)
Jarrod Sechler, a “youth pastor” at a local Christian church, filed suit against the State College Area High School because their holiday program was insufficiently Christian for him. According to a U.S. District Court, the presence of non-Christian symbols did not advance either those religions or express hostility
you know, in the old days the christmas warriors were trying to keep christmas out of walmart or whatever the equivalent was 70 years ago. and while i wouldn’t say that there were right, because they were doing so at least partly from antisemitism, they weren’t all wrong either. they recognized that the holiday was becoming secularized and they were trying to stop that process. needless to say, they failed. today in america, christmas is not a christian holiday anymore: it’s an entirely secular holiday, with its secular symbols — santa, the reindeer, the elves, the tree, the wreaths — its secular traditions of giving presents, and its secular hymns — rudolph the red-nosed reindeer, etc. — none of which have anything to do with the christian origins of the holiday (though, ironically, those left over from the pagan origins are still there). how did this happen? well, part of it was businesses who recognized that focusing ruthlessly on the gift-giving aspect was a good way to make money and secularizing the holiday ensured that everyone would celebrate it, making more money, and part of it was the christians who went out of their way to make the holiday a federal holiday, and what is more one of the most important federal holidays so that everybody has the day off and might as well celebrate somehow. atheists, liberals, and the aclu had nothing to do with it. the christmas guys probably do have some vague feeling that the holiday is just not theirs any more and they’re trying to get it back by insisting on the constant repetition of the word christmas, but this is not only unproductive, it’s counter-productive, as it only encourages the behavior that initially created the secularization. my guess is that in a while the hard-core christian types will make a break and abandon the gift-giving, santa, and the tree altogether, while the rest of us leave behind the the christian parts of the holiday (except the carols, some of those are quite nice) altogether. in the meantime, the christmas warriors will provide entertainment for us all, so it’s pretty much a win-win. and i’d close by wishing the christmas guys merry christmas, but since christmas is not for 19 days it seems a little premature.
Never assume anything.
Oh, wait, I see. TCG is attempting to bait us into making the nasty comments about Christmas that he’s having trouble finding on his own. Ah. Much this explains it does, yes, mmMMmmmMMMmmmm! Don’t give in to teh dark side with Mr. “White people are being out-reproduced, waaaahhhh!!1!” (ah, teh classix–dark side of white supremacy–har!). And, speaking of projection, Good Grief! Should we point him toward The R**e P*****t? Nah, that’d be too mean… to tha P****t.
Um… you don’t understand the meaning of the word, “pending,” do you, Bob?
More food for thought.
The ACLU Targets Christmas
The ACLU is at it again. With an outrageous boldness that only they could muster, the ACLU has, once again, set their sights on Christmas celebrations. In their never-ending quest to completely eradicate all things religious from public life, the ACLU’s latest lawsuit is an all-out frontal attack on the freedom of speech and the free exercise of religion.
Let me ask you—when did a children’s Christmas program become “an illegal activity”? When did the nativity story and Christmas songs become unconstitutional? This is the outrageous and dangerous charge the ACLU has leveled against a school district in Tennessee. A children’s Christmas program has been deemed to be an “illegal act” because of the ACLU.
This week, our senior attorneys at the American Center for Law and Justice are working on this latest ACLU case. The ACLU is absolutely determined to censor Christmas. They have sued the Wilson County School System outside of Nashville, TN. We represent several school officials and teachers who have been charged with engaging in what the ACLU calls “illegal acts.” The ACLU claims that the plaintiffs have been harmed, injured and “suffered irreparable damage” through the Christmas program because of its “Christian themes and songs.” The ACLU will then ask for these actions be declared “unconstitutional and illegal.”
It gets even worse. The plaintiffs and the ACLU allege that several kindergarten students role-played a nativity scene of the birth of Jesus—and had the audacity to sing “Away in the Manger” and “Joy to the World.” According to the ACLU, these songs are exclusively Christian in nature because they celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ and are, therefore, inappropriate. School programs that include a live nativity scene and the singing of songs like “Away in a Manger” are common throughout the United States and, indeed, around the world. Thousands of school students will be participating in similar programs this year. The ACLU has, once again, shown its desire to engage in censorship.
Of course, if the ACLU wins this case, it would set a precedent from across the nation. This is precisely why we have engaged some of our most senior lawyers to defend school officials in this important case. Make no mistake about it—the ACLU will not stop with this lawsuit. They may come to your town and target your school. Their continued attempts to loosen the threads of our religious heritage and chip away at the foundation of our freedom is never-ending.
We, at the American Center for Law and Justice, will fight for religious freedom and freedom of speech this Christmas. We are standing with the school officials in Wilson County and with concerned students and parents. We will vigorously defend the rights of these students to engage in free speech on public school campuses. We are not going to sit back and let the ACLU, the Ghost of Christmas Past, remove the joy and significance of this holiday season.
Today the American Center for Law and Justice has launched a nationwide campaign entitled “Keep HIM in Christmas.” We want to make sure that Jesus is at the center of this holiday. We want to keep HIM in the nativity scenes, keep HIM in the music, keep HIM as the focal point—and not allow the ACLU to operate as our nationwide censor.
Van Orden vs. Perry, (2004)
By a vote of 5-4, the Supreme Court on June 27, 2005 overturned a federal appeals court clearing the way for the constitutional display of thousands of monuments that have been in place across America. The decision came in a case in Texas where the Fraternal Order of Eagles donated a Commandments monument which has been in place outside the state capitol in Austin since 1961. The ACLJ filed an amicus brief at the high court asking the Justices to overturn a lower court decision declaring the monument unconstitutional. In its decision, the high court said the Eagles monument was constitutionally permissible.
McCreary County vs. ACLU, (2004)
By a vote of 5-4, the Supreme Court on June 27, 2005 upheld a lower court decision declaring the posting of copies of the Ten Commandments in the courthouses of two Kentucky counties to be unconstitutional. The ACLJ filed amicus briefs in support of the constitutionality of the displays which were declared unconstitutional by a federal district and federal appeals courts.
DeWeese v. ACLU of Ohio, (2004)
The Supreme Court on June 28, 2005 declined to take the ACLJ case out of Ohio where a poster of the Ten Commandments inside the courtroom of state Judge James DeWeese was declared unconstitutional. The lower court decision declaring the poster unconstitutional stands.
ACLU of Ohio v. Adams County, (2004)
The Supreme Court on June 28, 2005 declined to take the case out of Ohio where the ACLJ represents the Adams County school board which was sued for permitting a local ministerial association to erect monuments on school property which contain the Ten Commandments. After suit was filed, the Board changed the display into a Foundations of American Law and Government display which includes several other influential texts. A federal district court ruled in favor of the ACLU, and that decision was upheld by a federal appeals court. The high court declined to take the case and the lower court decision stands.
The ACLU Targets Christmas
The ACLU is at it again. With an outrageous boldness that only they could muster, the ACLU has, once again, set their sights on Christmas celebrations. In their never-ending quest to completely eradicate all things religious from public life, the ACLU’s latest lawsuit is an all-out frontal attack on the freedom of speech and the free exercise of religion.
Let me ask you—when did a children’s Christmas program become “an illegal activity”? When did the nativity story and Christmas songs become unconstitutional? This is the outrageous and dangerous charge the ACLU has leveled against a school district in Tennessee. A children’s Christmas program has been deemed to be an “illegal act” because of the ACLU.
This week, our senior attorneys at the American Center for Law and Justice are working on this latest ACLU case. The ACLU is absolutely determined to censor Christmas. They have sued the Wilson County School System outside of Nashville, TN. We represent several school officials and teachers who have been charged with engaging in what the ACLU calls “illegal acts.” The ACLU claims that the plaintiffs have been harmed, injured and “suffered irreparable damage” through the Christmas program because of its “Christian themes and songs.” The ACLU will then ask for these actions be declared “unconstitutional and illegal.”
It gets even worse. The plaintiffs and the ACLU allege that several kindergarten students role-played a nativity scene of the birth of Jesus—and had the audacity to sing “Away in the Manger” and “Joy to the World.” According to the ACLU, these songs are exclusively Christian in nature because they celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ and are, therefore, inappropriate. School programs that include a live nativity scene and the singing of songs like “Away in a Manger” are common throughout the United States and, indeed, around the world. Thousands of school students will be participating in similar programs this year. The ACLU has, once again, shown its desire to engage in censorship.
Of course, if the ACLU wins this case, it would set a precedent from across the nation. This is precisely why we have engaged some of our most senior lawyers to defend school officials in this important case. Make no mistake about it—the ACLU will not stop with this lawsuit. They may come to your town and target your school. Their continued attempts to loosen the threads of our religious heritage and chip away at the foundation of our freedom is never-ending.
We, at the American Center for Law and Justice, will fight for religious freedom and freedom of speech this Christmas. We are standing with the school officials in Wilson County and with concerned students and parents. We will vigorously defend the rights of these students to engage in free speech on public school campuses. We are not going to sit back and let the ACLU, the Ghost of Christmas Past, remove the joy and significance of this holiday season.
Today the American Center for Law and Justice has launched a nationwide campaign entitled “Keep HIM in Christmas.” We want to make sure that Jesus is at the center of this holiday. We want to keep HIM in the nativity scenes, keep HIM in the music, keep HIM as the focal point—and not allow the ACLU to operate as our nationwide censor.
Van Orden vs. Perry, (2004)
By a vote of 5-4, the Supreme Court on June 27, 2005 overturned a federal appeals court clearing the way for the constitutional display of thousands of monuments that have been in place across America. The decision came in a case in Texas where the Fraternal Order of Eagles donated a Commandments monument which has been in place outside the state capitol in Austin since 1961. The ACLJ filed an amicus brief at the high court asking the Justices to overturn a lower court decision declaring the monument unconstitutional. In its decision, the high court said the Eagles monument was constitutionally permissible.
McCreary County vs. ACLU, (2004)
By a vote of 5-4, the Supreme Court on June 27, 2005 upheld a lower court decision declaring the posting of copies of the Ten Commandments in the courthouses of two Kentucky counties to be unconstitutional. The ACLJ filed amicus briefs in support of the constitutionality of the displays which were declared unconstitutional by a federal district and federal appeals courts.
DeWeese v. ACLU of Ohio, (2004)
The Supreme Court on June 28, 2005 declined to take the ACLJ case out of Ohio where a poster of the Ten Commandments inside the courtroom of state Judge James DeWeese was declared unconstitutional. The lower court decision declaring the poster unconstitutional stands.
ACLU of Ohio v. Adams County, (2004)
The Supreme Court on June 28, 2005 declined to take the case out of Ohio where the ACLJ represents the Adams County school board which was sued for permitting a local ministerial association to erect monuments on school property which contain the Ten Commandments. After suit was filed, the Board changed the display into a Foundations of American Law and Government display which includes several other influential texts. A federal district court ruled in favor of the ACLU, and that decision was upheld by a federal appeals court. The high court declined to take the case and the lower court decision stands.
Seriously, did you read those cases you posted? I can’t hlp but notice that in almost all of them, the so-called anti-christmas party lost. And, I also can’t help but notice that none of those cases are current. Some are 26 years old. Christmas seems to have held up pretty well, regardless though.
As for the bullshit anti-ACLU screed, the ACLU has done more to protect religious freedom in this country than any other group. They just want it to remain free. IE., not on the taxpayer’s nickel and under Gubmint control. What conservatives really hate about the ACLU is that it supports the rights of other religions as well as Christianity.
As for the bullshit anti-ACLU screed, the ACLU has done more to protect religious freedom in this country than any other group. They just want it to remain free. IE., not on the taxpayer’s nickel and under Gubmint control. What conservatives really hate about the ACLU is that it supports the rights of other religions as well as Christianity.
Let me know when you guys have read enough.
Christmas Wars Intensify: Christians Asked to “Retake the Public Square for Christmas”
ANN ARBOR, MI, November 15, 2006 (LifeSiteNews.com) – For the last several years, the Thomas More Law Center, a national public interest laws firm based in Ann Arbor, Michigan has been successfully defending the right of Christians to display nativity scenes on public property and to celebrate Christmas in public schools. This year it has asked thousands of supporters to go on the offensive-where there has been no nativity display before, ask the government for permission to erect one; where the government has allowed a religious display of another faith, ask that a nativity display be erected on the same property as well; where there is a public forum for the exercise of free speech, ask for permission to erect a nativity display.
Commented Richard Thompson, President and Chief Counsel of the Law Center, “The ACLU war on Christmas is really a war on Christians. With few exceptions and then only to create a diversion from their real target, the ACLU avoids going after religious symbols of other faiths. Despite the fact over 80 percent of Americans are Christians, the ACLU has bullied elected representatives and school officials to eradicate the public celebration of Christmas under threat of lawsuits. Municipalities and schools should be aware that the systematic exclusion of Christmas symbols during the holiday season is not warranted, and such exclusion itself could be inconsistent with the Constitution and subject them to a possible lawsuit.”
More than a dozen files have been opened for possible litigation and more are expected. Moreover, several requests to erect Nativity displays are pending before local governments in several states.
Later this month, the United Sates Supreme Court will decide whether to grant review of a Thomas More Law Center case, Andrea Skoros v. City of New York. In that case, a sharply divided panel of the Second Circuit Court of Appeals upheld the right of New York City schools to discriminate against Christian symbols while specifically allowing Jewish and Islamic symbols. New York City school policy allows the display of the menorah during the Jewish holiday of Chanukah, and the Islamic star and crescent during the Muslim commemoration of Ramadan, but specifically excludes Nativity displays during Christmas – a nationally recognized legal holiday by both the Executive branch and Legislative branch, as well as a legal holiday for the State of New York.
In another Law Center case, the Third Circuit Court of Appeals recently reversed a lower court decision that had dismissed a complaint filed by the Law Center challenging a New Jersey school district’s total ban on Christmas music, including simple instrumentals. The Law Center’s complaint alleged that the school district’s ban on religious music conveys an impermissible government-sponsored message of hostility toward religion in violation of the Establishment Clause. The Third Circuit agreed that the Law Center’s complaint stated a constitutional claim and ordered that the case continue, reversing the lower court.
As part of its Christmas Campaign, the Law Center has asked its supporters to petition their local governments in writing for permission to erect nativity displays. Law Center staff attorneys are standing by to assist in the petition, and if legally appropriate, to file a federal lawsuit should they be denied. Moreover, the Law Center has asked its several hundred affiliated attorneys across the nation to assist in this year’s Christmas Campaign.
In 1984, Chief Justice Warren Burger had this to say in his opinion upholding the city of Pawtucket, Rhode Island’s nativity display:
“It would be ironic, however, if the inclusion of a single symbol of a particular historic religious event, as part of a celebration acknowledged in the Western World for 20 centuries, and in this country by the people, by the Executive Branch, by the Congress, and the courts for two centuries, would so ‘taint’ the City’s exhibit as to render it violative of the Establishment Clause. To forbid the use of this one passive symbol-the crèche-at the very time people are taking note of the season with Christmas hymns and carols in public schools and other public places, and while the Congress and Legislatures open sessions with prayers by paid chaplains would be a stilted over-reaction contrary to our history and to our holdings. If the presence of the crèche in this display violates the Establishment Clause, a host of other forms of taking official note of Christmas, and of our religious heritage, are equally offensive to the Constitution.”
According to the Law Center:
· A government body may constitutionally display a nativity scene on public property so long as the display includes secular items.
· The display of a nativity scene, as with any religious symbol, by a private person is religious speech that the First Amendment protects.
· The First Amendment protects private speech most strongly in a traditional public forum, such as a public park, or in what is known as a designated public forum, which is public property the government has designated for public assembly and speech,
· There should be no unreasonable prohibitions against public school students wishing each other “Merry Christmas,” distributing Christmas cards, or wearing clothing displaying a religious message.
· It is constitutionally permissible for schools to permit the study and performance of religious songs in its public schools, in order to promote the legitimate educational goal of “advancing the students’ knowledge of society’s cultural and religious heritage.”
Christmas Wars Intensify: Christians Asked to “Retake the Public Square for Christmas”
ANN ARBOR, MI, November 15, 2006 (LifeSiteNews.com) – For the last several years, the Thomas More Law Center, a national public interest laws firm based in Ann Arbor, Michigan has been successfully defending the right of Christians to display nativity scenes on public property and to celebrate Christmas in public schools. This year it has asked thousands of supporters to go on the offensive-where there has been no nativity display before, ask the government for permission to erect one; where the government has allowed a religious display of another faith, ask that a nativity display be erected on the same property as well; where there is a public forum for the exercise of free speech, ask for permission to erect a nativity display.
Commented Richard Thompson, President and Chief Counsel of the Law Center, “The ACLU war on Christmas is really a war on Christians. With few exceptions and then only to create a diversion from their real target, the ACLU avoids going after religious symbols of other faiths. Despite the fact over 80 percent of Americans are Christians, the ACLU has bullied elected representatives and school officials to eradicate the public celebration of Christmas under threat of lawsuits. Municipalities and schools should be aware that the systematic exclusion of Christmas symbols during the holiday season is not warranted, and such exclusion itself could be inconsistent with the Constitution and subject them to a possible lawsuit.”
More than a dozen files have been opened for possible litigation and more are expected. Moreover, several requests to erect Nativity displays are pending before local governments in several states.
Later this month, the United Sates Supreme Court will decide whether to grant review of a Thomas More Law Center case, Andrea Skoros v. City of New York. In that case, a sharply divided panel of the Second Circuit Court of Appeals upheld the right of New York City schools to discriminate against Christian symbols while specifically allowing Jewish and Islamic symbols. New York City school policy allows the display of the menorah during the Jewish holiday of Chanukah, and the Islamic star and crescent during the Muslim commemoration of Ramadan, but specifically excludes Nativity displays during Christmas – a nationally recognized legal holiday by both the Executive branch and Legislative branch, as well as a legal holiday for the State of New York.
In another Law Center case, the Third Circuit Court of Appeals recently reversed a lower court decision that had dismissed a complaint filed by the Law Center challenging a New Jersey school district’s total ban on Christmas music, including simple instrumentals. The Law Center’s complaint alleged that the school district’s ban on religious music conveys an impermissible government-sponsored message of hostility toward religion in violation of the Establishment Clause. The Third Circuit agreed that the Law Center’s complaint stated a constitutional claim and ordered that the case continue, reversing the lower court.
As part of its Christmas Campaign, the Law Center has asked its supporters to petition their local governments in writing for permission to erect nativity displays. Law Center staff attorneys are standing by to assist in the petition, and if legally appropriate, to file a federal lawsuit should they be denied. Moreover, the Law Center has asked its several hundred affiliated attorneys across the nation to assist in this year’s Christmas Campaign.
In 1984, Chief Justice Warren Burger had this to say in his opinion upholding the city of Pawtucket, Rhode Island’s nativity display:
“It would be ironic, however, if the inclusion of a single symbol of a particular historic religious event, as part of a celebration acknowledged in the Western World for 20 centuries, and in this country by the people, by the Executive Branch, by the Congress, and the courts for two centuries, would so ‘taint’ the City’s exhibit as to render it violative of the Establishment Clause. To forbid the use of this one passive symbol-the crèche-at the very time people are taking note of the season with Christmas hymns and carols in public schools and other public places, and while the Congress and Legislatures open sessions with prayers by paid chaplains would be a stilted over-reaction contrary to our history and to our holdings. If the presence of the crèche in this display violates the Establishment Clause, a host of other forms of taking official note of Christmas, and of our religious heritage, are equally offensive to the Constitution.”
According to the Law Center:
· A government body may constitutionally display a nativity scene on public property so long as the display includes secular items.
· The display of a nativity scene, as with any religious symbol, by a private person is religious speech that the First Amendment protects.
· The First Amendment protects private speech most strongly in a traditional public forum, such as a public park, or in what is known as a designated public forum, which is public property the government has designated for public assembly and speech,
· There should be no unreasonable prohibitions against public school students wishing each other “Merry Christmas,” distributing Christmas cards, or wearing clothing displaying a religious message.
· It is constitutionally permissible for schools to permit the study and performance of religious songs in its public schools, in order to promote the legitimate educational goal of “advancing the students’ knowledge of society’s cultural and religious heritage.”
Oh, I forgot there is no war on Christmas or Christianity in this country, this is what you must mean by the illusion of the war on Christmas. You guys better give it a rest.
“Can’t we all just get along” I wonder who coined that phrase.
“Can’t we all just get along” I wonder who coined that phrase.
Brian, you know as well as I do, that this has been going on a lot longer than 26 years, do I have to go back to its conception, 1947 I believe.
Do you mean to tell me that it is PERFECTLY LEGAL for students in public schools to wish each other “Merry Christmas”?? My God, what is this country coming to!!! It’s war, I tell you, war!
Yeah, well I’d like my Solstice celebration back – you guys have had it for more than 2000 years. Fair’s fair, don’t you think? Go rip off somebody else’s holiday for a change…
More than a dozen files have been opened for possible litigation and more are expected.
Doesn’t the right wing usually decry “frivolous lawsuits”? I guess they’re only frivolous when someone ends up mangled. And these are, by contrast, crucially important, because they involve plastic statues.
Doesn’t the right wing usually decry “frivolous lawsuits”? I guess they’re only frivolous when someone ends up mangled. And these are, by contrast, crucially important, because they involve plastic statues.
Thats my point, Xmas Guys. If Christmas has been under such a horrible assault for so long, how is it that anyone still celebrates it? Can you tell me one person who has been kept from celebrating Christmas? And I don’t in public, on the public square. I mean, in their homes, churches and hearts.
That Skoros case is bad law, the appeals court was wrong, and hopefully SCOTUS strikes it down. But the fact that the NYC DOE has a badly thought out policy on creches does not mean that Christmas is on the verge of being destroyed. I mean, for God’s sake, have you seen Rockefeller Plaza? I think that even in that terrible, godless Liberal city of New York, Christmas is going strong.
But, whatever. You’re not going to change your tune because this bogus War on Christmas is making you money and fame. I am done arguing with you because it’s a waste of space, and your the only one here that agrees with you.
Tell you what, if the AtheistIslamoCommie coup occurs, and we’re sent to the gulag together, I’ll smuggle you in some egg nog and a candy cane and admit you were right along. But I’m not too worried.
So please, have a Merry Christmas, really. I know I will. And I will for a long time.
That Skoros case is bad law, the appeals court was wrong, and hopefully SCOTUS strikes it down. But the fact that the NYC DOE has a badly thought out policy on creches does not mean that Christmas is on the verge of being destroyed. I mean, for God’s sake, have you seen Rockefeller Plaza? I think that even in that terrible, godless Liberal city of New York, Christmas is going strong.
But, whatever. You’re not going to change your tune because this bogus War on Christmas is making you money and fame. I am done arguing with you because it’s a waste of space, and your the only one here that agrees with you.
Tell you what, if the AtheistIslamoCommie coup occurs, and we’re sent to the gulag together, I’ll smuggle you in some egg nog and a candy cane and admit you were right along. But I’m not too worried.
So please, have a Merry Christmas, really. I know I will. And I will for a long time.
this has been going on a lot longer than 26 years, do I have to go back to its conception, 1947 I believe
59 inconclusive years? That’s a pretty ineffective war. Is Donald Rumsfeld running this one too?
59 inconclusive years? That’s a pretty ineffective war. Is Donald Rumsfeld running this one too?
I see a lot of rage over a simple cause like saving Christmas,
That isn’t rage, mate. It’s derision.
“Scorn and defiance; slight regard, contempt,
And any thing that may not misbecome
The mighty sender, doth he prize you at.”
That isn’t rage, mate. It’s derision.
“Scorn and defiance; slight regard, contempt,
And any thing that may not misbecome
The mighty sender, doth he prize you at.”
s.z.
Just Thank You for doing good. Sounds like you’re a bright light for a few people around you, which is probably the highest calling i can think of.
A fan.
Just Thank You for doing good. Sounds like you’re a bright light for a few people around you, which is probably the highest calling i can think of.
A fan.
I’m sure you mean ‘papist Italians’
When did encouraging people to not be dickweeds become persecution? Did I miss the memo on that one?
See, here’s the thing. I don’t care what people wish me this time of year. What I care about is the spirit behind the wish. I’d much rather have someone wish me Happy Holidays in true sincerity than I would have Merry Christmas flung at me in a spiteful game of spiritual one-upsmanship. And that’s what this whole War on Christmas thing feels like to me. It reminds me just a bit too much of a customer at the indy bookshop I worked at who, upon learning we didn’t have the full run of some cotton-candy fundamentalist romance novels, decided that we were part of some secularist plot to keep wholesome soft-core sex books from her teenage daughter and got verbally abusive. Her closing shot “well God bless you anyway” was an unmistakable “fuck you.” It took most of my self control not reply in the same spirit.
That was back in my hillbilly days, now I’m living in a rust belt city with the full panoply of religions, races, and creeds. The nearest Target is in an area that’s got a mix of african-americans, orthodox jews, and few catholics, mostly irish. Now, maybe I’m a demented grinchy sec-pro (my rector down to the cathedral would be surprised to hear that but hey if Fox News says it’s true who are the Gospels to say otherwise) but I think that Target should be able to tell its staff that they can’t just assume a customer is celebrating Christmas. That nice woman with the 5 kids under 7 could just as easily be Orthodox as she could Catholic. You don’t know for sure, so unless you do know why is Happy Holidays the wrong thing to say? Why is pausing to consider another’s feelings the wrong thing to do?
And if you do know, say it’s obvious that the aforementioned nice lady is wearing a wig and she’s got a chaim or a star of david on a necklace, and you go forward with Merry Christmas anyway, well then you’re being an asshole. You’re not wishing her any joys of the season, you’re wishing her a fuck you. And Target ought to be able to tell its staff that they can’t do that.
These people, they’re turning Merry Christmas into an assault. It’s not about protecting Christmas or celebrating the Christlike ideal; it’s about turning a holy day into a profane attempt to bully and dominate. It’s about making themselves feel big by making others feel small. It’s sinful. It’s wrong.
These tools are all giggly over what the Pope might think or how Fox and Friends think they’re cool. It’s the on-line equivalent of a 14 year old girls spiral bound notebook covered with Mrs. Bob Marley-Pope written in different styles of curley-Q cursive with hearts drawn around it and Fawks Rawks!11!! in metal script.
Maybe they ought to be more concerned with what God thinks.
See, here’s the thing. I don’t care what people wish me this time of year. What I care about is the spirit behind the wish. I’d much rather have someone wish me Happy Holidays in true sincerity than I would have Merry Christmas flung at me in a spiteful game of spiritual one-upsmanship. And that’s what this whole War on Christmas thing feels like to me. It reminds me just a bit too much of a customer at the indy bookshop I worked at who, upon learning we didn’t have the full run of some cotton-candy fundamentalist romance novels, decided that we were part of some secularist plot to keep wholesome soft-core sex books from her teenage daughter and got verbally abusive. Her closing shot “well God bless you anyway” was an unmistakable “fuck you.” It took most of my self control not reply in the same spirit.
That was back in my hillbilly days, now I’m living in a rust belt city with the full panoply of religions, races, and creeds. The nearest Target is in an area that’s got a mix of african-americans, orthodox jews, and few catholics, mostly irish. Now, maybe I’m a demented grinchy sec-pro (my rector down to the cathedral would be surprised to hear that but hey if Fox News says it’s true who are the Gospels to say otherwise) but I think that Target should be able to tell its staff that they can’t just assume a customer is celebrating Christmas. That nice woman with the 5 kids under 7 could just as easily be Orthodox as she could Catholic. You don’t know for sure, so unless you do know why is Happy Holidays the wrong thing to say? Why is pausing to consider another’s feelings the wrong thing to do?
And if you do know, say it’s obvious that the aforementioned nice lady is wearing a wig and she’s got a chaim or a star of david on a necklace, and you go forward with Merry Christmas anyway, well then you’re being an asshole. You’re not wishing her any joys of the season, you’re wishing her a fuck you. And Target ought to be able to tell its staff that they can’t do that.
These people, they’re turning Merry Christmas into an assault. It’s not about protecting Christmas or celebrating the Christlike ideal; it’s about turning a holy day into a profane attempt to bully and dominate. It’s about making themselves feel big by making others feel small. It’s sinful. It’s wrong.
These tools are all giggly over what the Pope might think or how Fox and Friends think they’re cool. It’s the on-line equivalent of a 14 year old girls spiral bound notebook covered with Mrs. Bob Marley-Pope written in different styles of curley-Q cursive with hearts drawn around it and Fawks Rawks!11!! in metal script.
Maybe they ought to be more concerned with what God thinks.
Christmas Guys, you are johnny-come-latelys to this blog, so it probably hasn’t dawned on you that s.z. wasn’t making up all that stuff she posted about doing for others. I don’t know if she did it all in one day or in exactly that sequence–I don’t know, maybe she can tell us if she feels like it–but she is, in fact, that giving and indefatigable a person. You should be ashamed to come here and sanctimoniously malign her blog, and in the name of Jesus yet. All you’re doing is attention-seeking and using Christmas to rail against an imaginary enemy, you bunch of Scrooges.
I’ve already had my fun with TCG–but I’d just like to note that, in another thread, this genius had declared he was leaving this site and never coming back THREE times when I stopped counting.
Attention whores and their addiction–it’s sad, in a can’t-stop-snickering kind of way. TCG mixes attention-whoring with his Christian persecution complex for a unbeatable hilarity combo.
Happy Holidays!
Attention whores and their addiction–it’s sad, in a can’t-stop-snickering kind of way. TCG mixes attention-whoring with his Christian persecution complex for a unbeatable hilarity combo.
Happy Holidays!
Same to you! And let’s put the X back in Xmas this year! 
“Scorn and defiance; slight regard, contempt,
And any thing that may not misbecome
The mighty sender, doth he prize you at.”
Left by ajay on December 6th, 2006
Yeah, but you forgot the best part:
“What treasure, uncle?”
“Tennis-balls, my liege.”
Later,
“Say, if my father render fair return, It is against my will; for I desire Nothing but odds with England: to that end,
As matching to his youth and vanity, I did present him with the Paris balls.”
Merry Ballmas to one and all!
And any thing that may not misbecome
The mighty sender, doth he prize you at.”
Left by ajay on December 6th, 2006
Yeah, but you forgot the best part:
“What treasure, uncle?”
“Tennis-balls, my liege.”
Later,
“Say, if my father render fair return, It is against my will; for I desire Nothing but odds with England: to that end,
As matching to his youth and vanity, I did present him with the Paris balls.”
Merry Ballmas to one and all!
s.z., you are made of awesome. It’s very telling that TCGs have not said anything about your good deeds, even when prompted by other commenters.
I say to you, TCG, and every other reader of this fine blog what I say to everyone I meet – have a good holiday.
I say to you, TCG, and every other reader of this fine blog what I say to everyone I meet – have a good holiday.
Italy, Catholic Newspapaer Mussolini, Pope, Rome, Brain hurt forced to communicate in fractured sentences.
Let me know when you guys have read enough.
When.
When.
where is your sanctimonious rage when a black muslim stands up in America and calls for the extermination of the white race, globally I might add with out consequence.
Please check here first, Chritmas Ghouls.
Please check here first, Chritmas Ghouls.
His marching orders to consumers: “Don’t sit back and complain. It takes five minutes. Pick up the phone, go online, find a company’s CEO and barrage him with emails.”
Don’t just complain! Go complain some more!
Let’s put the Saturn back in Saturnalia!
Happy Hoppin’ Hippie Holidays to all; whether you want it or not.
Don’t just complain! Go complain some more!
Let’s put the Saturn back in Saturnalia!
Happy Hoppin’ Hippie Holidays to all; whether you want it or not.
I have to say, they all sure bugged out quick. Christmas is clearly in dire straits if the Warriors are exhausted after a mere three days of trolling.
Maybe he was just arrested. Upthread, it sure sounded like he was inciting to riot, with his “go on teh offensive!!1!” horse poo. And, inciting to riot is against the law.
These people, they’re turning Merry Christmas into an assault. It’s not about protecting Christmas or celebrating the Christlike ideal; it’s about turning a holy day into a profane attempt to bully and dominate. It’s about making themselves feel big by making others feel small. It’s sinful. It’s wrong.
These tools are all giggly over what the Pope might think or how Fox and Friends think they’re cool. It’s the on-line equivalent of a 14 year old girls spiral bound notebook covered with Mrs. Bob Marley-Pope written in different styles of curley-Q cursive with hearts drawn around it and Fawks Rawks!11!! in metal script.
Maybe they ought to be more concerned with what God thinks.
Left by Cornfed on December 6th, 2006
Hear, hear! Thanks, Cornfed.
These tools are all giggly over what the Pope might think or how Fox and Friends think they’re cool. It’s the on-line equivalent of a 14 year old girls spiral bound notebook covered with Mrs. Bob Marley-Pope written in different styles of curley-Q cursive with hearts drawn around it and Fawks Rawks!11!! in metal script.
Maybe they ought to be more concerned with what God thinks.
Left by Cornfed on December 6th, 2006
Hear, hear! Thanks, Cornfed.
Add my thanks, Cornfed. Also, I loved you on Duckman.
Marq, it’s entirely possible. It’s certainly more likely than Option B, which is “They all felt ashamed of themselves for wasting their time and money this season on something so goddamned stupid and went off to help someone in need”. Still, one lives in hope.
Marq, it’s entirely possible. It’s certainly more likely than Option B, which is “They all felt ashamed of themselves for wasting their time and money this season on something so goddamned stupid and went off to help someone in need”. Still, one lives in hope.
I think Cornfed’s comment deserves a medal of some sort, but you all have been great. God, I love this blog!!!
Still waiting for an answer to my questions, Christmas Guys…
You wouldn’t happen to be fearful of debating l’il ole me, now would you? *batting eyelids*
*polishing up “Clergy” badge*
We ordained Christian ministers are pussycats, darlings…
You wouldn’t happen to be fearful of debating l’il ole me, now would you? *batting eyelids*
*polishing up “Clergy” badge*
We ordained Christian ministers are pussycats, darlings…
Thanks for the kind words folks. I’ll try to speak up more often although, of course, the spewing of bile is never a permanent solution.
D. Sidhe, I’e been trying to get the series out on DVD but Duckman insists that it has to be a special edition set with a complimentary inflatable woman and the good people Klasky Csupo won’t go for it.
D. Sidhe, I’e been trying to get the series out on DVD but Duckman insists that it has to be a special edition set with a complimentary inflatable woman and the good people Klasky Csupo won’t go for it.
[...] You know what bugs me? The War on Christmas people. “Put the Christ back in Christmas,” and “Remember the reason for the season.” Holy crap. The reason for the season is the Sun, people. Jesus was probably born in April. [...]
“Can someone please explain to me exactly what it is that Christmas needs saving from? …”
Dan Someone,
I’d be happy to oblige. Christmas needs saving from the same horror which traditional marriage needs to be defended from. Hope that clears things up!
And Cornfed, I echo the kudos!
Dan Someone,
I’d be happy to oblige. Christmas needs saving from the same horror which traditional marriage needs to be defended from. Hope that clears things up!
And Cornfed, I echo the kudos!
Perhaps the spewing of bile is not a permanent solution, but I find it helps from time to time. If nothing else, it lets me make my unpleasant first reactions in front of trolls, who are unlikely to ever be persuaded by reasonable discussion, so that I can attempt said reasonable discussion with family members, who may be.
And, the inflatable doll is okay, but please, none of those stupid cheap plastic head-shaped cases The Simpsons started doing. They don’t fit in my rack, and they get brittle and crack if you don’t maintain archival vault environmental conditions.
And, the inflatable doll is okay, but please, none of those stupid cheap plastic head-shaped cases The Simpsons started doing. They don’t fit in my rack, and they get brittle and crack if you don’t maintain archival vault environmental conditions.
Wow, I thought the war on Xmas was made up, but I can’t argue with this:
Sechler v. State College Area School District (2000)
Jarrod Sechler, a “youth pastor” at a local Christian church, filed suit against the State College Area High School because their holiday program was insufficiently Christian for him. According to a U.S. District Court, the presence of non-Christian symbols did not advance either those religions or express hostility
SAVE US JESUS! At no point was the pastor allowed to storm into the school, track down the kids who were wishing each other happy holidays, and haul them off to reeducation camps, so we clarly have a problem here. We also have no clear mechanism to infiltrate kids’ brains, kill their brain cells and make them stop asking stuff their teachers stuff like, “Why do we have to sing these Christmas songs? There is a separation of Church and State, you know!” so our entire way of life is in danger.
Sechler v. State College Area School District (2000)
Jarrod Sechler, a “youth pastor” at a local Christian church, filed suit against the State College Area High School because their holiday program was insufficiently Christian for him. According to a U.S. District Court, the presence of non-Christian symbols did not advance either those religions or express hostility
SAVE US JESUS! At no point was the pastor allowed to storm into the school, track down the kids who were wishing each other happy holidays, and haul them off to reeducation camps, so we clarly have a problem here. We also have no clear mechanism to infiltrate kids’ brains, kill their brain cells and make them stop asking stuff their teachers stuff like, “Why do we have to sing these Christmas songs? There is a separation of Church and State, you know!” so our entire way of life is in danger.
There is an international War on Christmas!!
http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,,1967368,00.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,,1967368,00.html
I just can’t wrap my brain around this argument. When O’Leilly started this absurdity I thought it would ruin him with ridicule. And now there are threads on numerous blogs trying to combat this nonsense.
WTF? How did our national discourse plummet so quickly as to argue about a phantom War on a Random Holiday?
We are better than this, bigger than this, above this. Ignore them if at all possible, as these are the fake issues that take our attention away from Iraq, national health care and a host of other issues. Ignore these morons.
It’s incredibly Orwellian: We’ve always been at war with Christmas.
WTF? How did our national discourse plummet so quickly as to argue about a phantom War on a Random Holiday?
We are better than this, bigger than this, above this. Ignore them if at all possible, as these are the fake issues that take our attention away from Iraq, national health care and a host of other issues. Ignore these morons.
It’s incredibly Orwellian: We’ve always been at war with Christmas.
Oh, and BTW Christmas Idiots…it’s spelled ‘vile’ not ‘vial’.
Ever thought of taking some ESL courses?
Ever thought of taking some ESL courses?
Why do you think this country has never had a Stalin or a Mussolini?”
Um, because our country is called “The United States of Jesus”? Or is it because we believe in Christ, unlike the pagan Russianns or heathen Italians?
You gotta understand that for these wackos, Catholics (Eastern Orthodox or Roman) aren’t really Christians. Remember the Bob Jones University kerfuffle.
Um, because our country is called “The United States of Jesus”? Or is it because we believe in Christ, unlike the pagan Russianns or heathen Italians?
You gotta understand that for these wackos, Catholics (Eastern Orthodox or Roman) aren’t really Christians. Remember the Bob Jones University kerfuffle.
s.z. you are kind, generous, and compassionate. I’d be proud to call you my friend.
Nice Post.
That was well said. Always appreciate your indepth views. Keep up the great work!
John
That was well said. Always appreciate your indepth views. Keep up the great work!
John
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